Windows Server 2008: Virtualization (October 2, 2007)

Chat Topic: Windows Server 2008: Virtualization
Date: Tuesday, October 02, 2007

Please note: Portions of this transcript have been edited for clarity.

Experts: Patrick O’Rourke, Mike Neil, Rajiv Arunkundram, Rakesh Malhotra, Allen Stewart, Arno Mihm
Moderator: Don Spencer
Newsgroups:
https://blogs.technet.com/windowsserver/
https://blogs.technet.com/windowsserver/archive/2007/05/10/viridian-features-update-beta-planned-for-longhorn-rtm.aspx
https://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver2008/default.mspx
https://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver2008/virtualization/default.mspx
https://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver2008/en/servermanager/virtualization.mspx
https://blogs.msdn.com/virtual_pc_guy/
https://download.microsoft.com/download/5/b/9/5b97017b-e28a-4bae-ba48-174cf47d23cd/VIR047_WH06.ppt
https://www.microsoft.com/whdc/winhec/pres06.mspx

Don_MSFT (Moderator):
Welcome to today’s chat. Our topic today is Windows Server 2008: Virtualization.

Don_MSFT (Moderator):
We are pleased to welcome our experts for today. I will have them introduce themselves now.

Introductions:

Patrick_MSFT (Expert):
Hi, Patrick O'Rourke here. I'm a group manager on the product marketing side of things. I blog on the Windows Server Division blog: https://blogs.technet.com/windowsserver/.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Hello, I’m Mike Neil, the general manager for virtualization at Microsoft and work in the Windows Server division. Looking forward to chatting with you today.

Rajiv_MS (Expert):
Hi. Welcome to TechNet chat on virtualization. I am Rajiv Arunkundram, a Senior Product Manager on server virtualization. Looking forward to chatting with you today.

RakeshM_MSFT (Expert):
Hi, I'm Rakesh Malhotra, and I'm the Group Program Manager for System Center Virtual Machine Manager, so my focus is on management of virtualized environments. Welcome!

Allen_MSFT (Expert):
Allen Stewart here, PM in the Windows Server Division working the various virtualization product groups.

Don_MSFT (Moderator):
I'm your moderator, Don Spencer. I’m an editor in the Connected Systems

Start of chat:

Patrick_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Is Virtual Server 2005 an acceptable topic for this discussion?
A: You bet it is. Go ahead and ask your Qs.

Rajiv_MS (Expert):
Q: Will 2008 Virtualization support vmotion like migration of a running virtual machine?
A: WSv will support migration capability for both planned and unplanned downtime and the solution is called Quick Migration.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Does Viridian support SCSI drives? If so, where can I get the driver?
A: Viridian supports our new virtualized I/O architecture. You can install separate synthetic disk controllers that can each support up to 255 VHDs. This is done through the MMC UI. The drivers for this new synthetic devices are included as part of the Viridian release.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: The configuration file (C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Documents\Shared Virtual Networks\External Network (Broadcom NetXtreme 5751 Gigabit Controller).vnc) referenced by the configuration link" C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Microsoft\Virtual Server\Virtual Networks\External Network (Broadcom NetXtreme 5751 Gigabit Controller).lnk" could not be found. The hardware is a Dell low-end server Machine has two NICs; however, only the Broadcom is in use. The OS is SBS, R2—evaluation copy (good for 180 days). Does anyone have any idea about this VS error?
A: Nothing came through as the error?

Allen_MSFT (Expert):
Q: The configuration file (C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Documents\Shared Virtual Networks\External Network (Broadcom NetXtreme 5751 Gigabit Controller).vnc) referenced by the configuration link" C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Microsoft\Virtual Server\Virtual Networks\External Network (Broadcom NetXtreme 5751 Gigabit Controller).lnk" could not be found. The hardware is a Dell low-end server Machine has two NICs; however, only the Broadcom is in use. The OS is SBS, R2—evaluation copy (good for 180 days). Does anyone have any idea about this VS error?
A: lad, as far as the missing Virtual Network configuration file, you should be able to create another virtual network and associate it with the active Broadcom adapter.

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: The configuration file (C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Documents\Shared Virtual Networks\External Network (Broadcom NetXtreme 5751 Gigabit Controller).vnc) cannot be found.
A: Was the external network ever deleted during the course of new Virtual networks being created?

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: I do not remember the external network being deleted. The administrative website shows the proper path.
A: I assume this error happened directly after installation and, if so, this means that the inbox virtual networks did not set up correctly. Internal and external are default networks.

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: The .vnc file is in the proper directory.
A: That does not mean the virtual network was set up correctly during install.

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Error is in previous two text transmissions.
A: Got it.

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Is there a solution to the .vnc error?
A: Did this happen directly after virtual server installation? If so, then the inbox virtual networks did not get set up correctly. You can re-create the networks and you should be fine, or reinstall Virtual Server to re-create the virtual networks.

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: So, you are recommending deleting and re-creating the virtual networks as one possible solution?
A: Yes.

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Deleting and re-creating the external virtual network seems to have eliminated this error.
A: Great!

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: I’m working now in a project with VMware GSX 3.0 and a big infrastructure Cisco with Catalyst 6500 and Cisco Application Control Engine (ACE) . My question is, is there any blueprint or documentation about integration of Cisco and Microsoft virtualization solutions?
A: I'm not aware of any guidance here.

Patrick_MSFT (Expert):
Q: With the delay of Windows Server 2008, will Viridian be delayed as well or are you on schedule?
A: We reset timing of Viridian beta in May (https://blogs.technet.com/windowsserver/archive/2007/05/10/viridian-features-update-beta-planned-for-longhorn-rtm.aspx); a beta of Viridian will be available with the RTM of Windows Server 2008. And right now you can get the CTP of Viridian with RC0 of Windows Server 2008.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Is it possible to migrate a current VM from VPC/VS 2007 to Viridian? It requires reactivation if you just load it there...
A: The VHD files are compatible, but depending on the guest OS you are running there may be specific issues. You should first uninstall the Virtual Server Additions under VS before you move the image.

Rajiv_MS (Expert):
Q: Can you explain Quick Migration? Will users get disconnected from the server while it’s being migrated?
A: The quick migration process puts a virtual machine into saved state and moves it over and resumes it on the destination host system. The whole process takes about 5-10 seconds for a VM with about 1 GB of Memory. The user interruption will be dependent on the type of application and the latency that the application can tolerate—in some cases, there will be slight disruption for the users.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: is Viridian still in closed beta, and is there a way to still get in on it?
A: Viridian CTP was just released as part of the Windows Server 2008 RC0 release. (https://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver2008/default.mspx)

RakeshM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Will VMM work with Viridian? Is this chat limited to only Viridian, or can we ask questions regarding virtualizing Windows Server 2008 in VS 2005 R2 SP1?
A: The next version of VMM will definitely support Viridian. We should have a beta available early next year and a final release will coincide with the final Viridian release. We also plan to extend VMM to support additional hypervisors including VMware and Xen.

Patrick_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Are you going to make newer (than 13.813) VS additions for running Windows Server 2008 guests?
A: We'll update the VS additions as necessary to support Windows Server 2008 guests; can't say when right now.

ArnoM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: NEW build of (1) SBS 2003 R2 x32, (2) Webserver x64 & (3)PABX x64 Server... on Windows Server 2008, WVS has been up for 8 days. One problem: can't get COM port working. How do you get named pipes working on Windows Server 2008?
A: Mapping a physical COM port into the VM is not supported. You need to map a named pipe from the parent partition. The pipe is created through the Settings dialog when you set up the named pipe/COM port relationship.

ArnoM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Q5, yes, I know, but how do you set up the pipe on the parent partition?
A: It is created through the dialog.

ArnoM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Hi, Arno in the dialog, where?
A: The Setting dialog for the VM.

ArnoM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Arno, I did this, but don't have connection, so I set up the pipe in the settings for the VM, OK, and the corresponding on the parent partition, how?
A: The pipe is created on the parent and maps to the COM port within the VM.

ArnoM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Arno, thank you, but how do you create the pipe?
A: In the host, you create them via tools like debugger, etc.

ArnoM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Arno, I did this, but don't have connection, so I set up the pipe in the settings for the VM, OK, and the corresponding on the parent partition, how?
A: Please use tools like debuggers, etc. to do that…

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: How do I add an extra SCSI hard drive to my virtual server in Viridian? I’ve added it, but I do not see it in disk management in my virtual server.
A: In the MMC, with the VM turned off, you can add the virtual SCSI controller to the VM configuration. This is done in the panel labeled “Add Hardware.” Once you do this a new controller will appear down in the MMC UI and you can configure the VHDs that are attached to that controller.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: I've added it and set the VHD path and file name. Do I need actual SCSI hardware to add a SCSI hard drive?
A: No, you don't need to have a physical SCSI controller. What guest OS version are you running in the VM?

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Neil, I'm running x64 Vista RTM.
A: We have not tested with Vista for the CTP as this preview was focused on Server.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Neil, after I've added the SCSI drive should I be able to see it in my V-PC disk manager?
A: You likely need to install the integration components. With a VM running, open up the RDP control window and select the last Action in the menu. This will mount the ISO image in the VM and you can run the installer from there.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Should creating a SCSI drive and pointing to a Windows Server 2008 RC0 install ISO work and install on SCSI drive?
A: The ISO can be connected to the IDE controller.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Mike, can the ISO be connected to the SCSI controller?
A: You need to attach the ISO to the IDE controller.

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Why do I get an error when pointing to a VHD on a network share? Sorry, last question.
A: Check permissions on the share that you are pointing to.

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Does the share for VHD need read and write?
A: Yes.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: So, SCSI Viridian drivers are installed and should work out of the box, correct? :D
A: The integration components will be included with Viridian and contain the synthetic VMBus disk drivers.

Patrick_MSFT (Expert):
Q: What is the difference between Windows Server 2008 Virtualization and VMWare?
A: Windows Server virtualization is a feature of Windows Server 2008. You can read more here: https://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver2008/virtualization/default.mspx and https://technet2.microsoft.com/windowsserver2008/en/servermanager/virtualization.mspx.

RakeshM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: I echo mes007's question regarding RC0 and VMAddition issues, especially when trying to create a Windows Server 2008 RC0 template in VMM. What are the expected config steps in getting RC0 to work in VMM?
A: All Windows Server applications have a built-in snapshot interface that all of our backup partners use (Veritas, CommVault, Tivoli, etc.) and build 'agents' for. Virtualized systems have the identical infrastructure so you can continue to use whichever backup solution you already have and don't need to buy or deploy anything exotic. We also have a great backup product called System Center Data Protection Manager that can handle this for you directly as well. You can back up either from within the guest or at the host level without deploying agents inside of the guest (for bare metal/DR scenarios, this is particularly useful).

RakeshM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: I echo mes007's question regarding RC0 and VMAddition issues, especially when trying to create a Windows Server 2008 RC0 template in VMM. What are the expected config steps in getting RC0 to work in VMM?
A: We'll have an updated version of VMM that supports Viridian early next year in beta—the version we just released is designed for Virtual Server. We'll have a final release of VMM that supports Viridian at the same time Viridian is released.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Why does WSv server require two physical NICs?
A: It does not require two. We suggest this because we need to pull down the network connection during installation. If you are doing an install over the net, this will cause a failure.

Rajiv_MS (Expert):
Q: A: Viridian CTP was just released as part of the Windows Server 2008 RC0 release—does this then obsolete VMM/VS2005 as the platform for virtualizing 2K8?
A: WSv (aka Viridian) has certain hardware requirements—x64 hardware with hardware-assisted virtualization capable chips (IVT or AMD-V). For virtualizing on top of 32-bit hardware or for systems that do not support IVT or AMDV, Virtual Server is still a relevant solution. With Virtual Machine Manager being able to manage both WSv and VS, you will still be able to benefit from a unified management console.

RakeshM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: RE: Question 21—Rakesh, I'm not talking about snapshot or backup at all. I'm asking specifically how to test RC0 in VMM TODAY, for example, creating an RC0 self-service template.
A: Sorry, my reply got posted to the wrong question. You'll have to wait for the beta release of the next version of VMM for Viridian support. Expect that early next year, Deji.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Since there doesn't seem to be a compatible sysprep/VMAddition for RC0, how does MS suggest we test RC0 in our VS2005/VMM environment?
A: You can run RC0 under VS 2005 R2 SP1 on a VT/AMD-V system without additions until we have Windows Server 2008 additions available.

RakeshM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: RE: question 35, so can we conclude that VMM does not support RC0 at this time for self-service template? You need VMAddition in order to prep the reference guest.
A: Correct - the current version of VMM supports Windows Server 2003, and Windows Server 2008 will be supported in the next version (working on it as we speak...).

RakeshM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: RE: question 35, so can we conclude that VMM does not support RC0 at this time for self-service template? You need VMAddition in order to prep the reference guest.
A: Just to clarify a point—this doesn't work today not due to additions support, but rather because we haven't yet written the code to templatize and customize Windows Server 2008.....we're hard at work on this, though.

Patrick_MSFT (Expert):
Q: I have Core x64 running. Is WSv available as an installable role, or do I need to get a new version of Core to install the role for WSV?
A: The Windows Server virtualization CTP only runs with a full installation of Windows Server 2008 RC0 at this time.

Patrick_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Is there a timeline when Core will run WSv?
A: WSv beta will run in server core, since WSv will be available with RTM of WS08

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: VMWare has become the market gorilla in the virtualization space. What feature(s) of Viridian will cause customers to reconsider their virtualization deployment decisions?
A: You likely need to install the integration components in the guest. With a VM running, open up the RDP control window and select the last Action in the menu. This will mount the ISO image in the VM and you can run the installer from there.

Rajiv_MS (Expert):
Q: What type of clustering solution will be available for Virtual Server 2008?
A: Are you referring to Windows Server Virtualization as a part of Windows Server 2008 (aka Viridian)? If yes, we will support integration with Microsoft clustering for both planned and unplanned downtime. With this, you also get support for Geographically dispersed clusters.

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: So, you are recommending deleting and re-creating the virtual networks as one possible solution?
A: A better solution would be to reinstall because this may be a sign of additional problems you may experience.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Does Viridian support drag and drop files from V-PC to host? If so, how do I do it?
A: You can RDP into the guest directly and it will allow files to be moved, but through the Viridian console UI you cannot drag and drop files from the host to the guest.

RakeshM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: Re Q45—thanks for the info. I recommend that you update the VMM FAQ (or other relevant public doc) to reflect this point. Been struggling with this for over a week.
A: That is a good point. Sorry for the confusion, Deji. We'll clarify our documentation.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Will all Linux flavors be supported?
A: We will support specific Linux distributions.

Allenste_MSFT (Expert):
Q: What is the command to update group policy?
A: gpupdate.

Rajiv_MS (Expert):
Q: RE: q47, I refer to clustering servers to run multiple virtual instances and if one box fails, another box in the cluster can take the load of the VMs.
A: Yes, we do support clustering at both the guest OS level and the host level, and we can ensure that if a box fails, all the VMs will automatically failover.

Patrick_MSFT (Expert):
Q: VMware has become the market gorilla in the virtualization space. What feature(s) of Viridian will cause customers to reconsider their virtualization deployment decisions?
A: I'll preface by saying it depends on who the customer is and that the virtualization decision is never just about features (i.e., tech support, existing skills, price, management, compatibility, etc.). Windows hypervisor is about 1MB. Clustering (planned and unplanned downtime) comes with Windows Server 2008, whereas VMware charges thousands per CPU. Virtual SCSI: Windows Server virtualization provides support for virtual storage adapters that support up to 256 virtual hard disks per virtual storage adapter through its new Virtualization Service Client for storage with support for up two storage adapters. This means you can attach up to 512 virtual hard disks to a Windows Server virtualization virtual machine. Large virtual machine memory support: Windows Server virtualization provides support for virtual machines with greater than 32 GB of memory per virtual machine. Geographic dispersed clustering comes with Windows Server 2008. Oh yeah, WSv is available with Windows Server 2008.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: RE question 51: So you can set up say a cluster of three servers, set utilization of 70%, load the VMs, and if one box fails the other two pick up the slack. Is this correct?
A: Correct. When a physical host fails, we will restart that physical machine’s VMs on the other nodes in the cluster.

Rajiv_MS (Expert):
Q: RE question 56, does the hardware within the cluster still have to be identical?
A: Nope.

Rajiv_MS (Expert):
Q: RE question 56, does the hardware within the cluster still have to be identical?
A: For enabling quick migration of VMs though, the processors have to be architecturally compatible.

Patrick_MSFT (Expert):
Q: What are the minimal hardware requirements for Windows Server 2008?
A: We've only published the hardware requirements for WSv CTP. Windows Server virtualization requires an x64-based processor, hardware-assisted virtualization (AMD-V or Intel VT), and hardware data execution protection. Ben also provided more details here: https://blogs.msdn.com/virtual_pc_guy/.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Will the hypervisor always run on top of a Windows Server?
A: The Windows hypervisor does not run on top of Windows Server, it is a layer beneath it. You can see more of the architecture in this slide deck: https://download.microsoft.com/download/5/b/9/5b97017b-e28a-4bae-ba48-174cf47d23cd/VIR047_WH06.ppt.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: That link for the hypervisor architecture doesn’t work.
A:https://www.microsoft.com/whdc/winhec/pres06.mspx

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: RE question 62: does quick migration translate to failover also?
A: We provide Quick Migration to deal with planned downtime, and clustering to deal with unplanned failures. Both are built on the same underpinnings, so if you use the same infrastructure for both.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Will hypervision allow boot from SAN?
A: You can boot the physical machine from SAN, and you can also boot VMs from LUNs on a SAN or from VHDs stored on a SAN.

ArnoM_MSFT (Expert):
Q: I can't remember the command to verify that the hypervisor is present and running. (I think it was hv???...) Someone of the Hand-on Labs experts at TechEd showed that.
A: Just check the perf counter in the parent partition Hypervisor->Partitions. If the counter is 1 or bigger, the hypervisor is running.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Why does WSv server require two physical NICs?
A: We publish the Windows catalog closer to RTM.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: HCL for HBAs to boot from SAN, that is.
A: I’m not sure if this is called out separately.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Q: Will you have a HCL for HBAs?
A: We publish the Windows catalog closer to RTM.

Mike Neil - MSFT (Expert):
Thanks!

RakeshM_MSFT (Expert):
Thanks everyone!

Rajiv_MS (Expert):
Thanks everyone.

ArnoM_MSFT (Expert):
Bye!